Welcome Kim English

[GMUSSTN]

There are a lot of sides to this but I keep thinking that the instability of losing CKE right now is the biggest downside...he made some considerable improvements to the program but nothing that I don't think another coach would have been able to accomplish. At the same time, starting over and losing key recruits would be a rough pill to swallow.

That being said, CKE doesn't have a ton of stability from the school right now either. No AD, and still months away from one. If I was working somewhere and my boss quit, and they were still looking for my new boss, and another company tried to poach me with more money, you bet I'm going to consider it. I can't fault the guy, and neither should any of you. We could easily hire a new AD who doesn't like CKE and makes life difficult for him, and by that point the offers might be dried up and he'd be in a bad spot.

Overall the frustration of Mason just being a stepping stone for people (Cabrera used us, Cabrera hired Brad Edwards who clearly wasn't going to be here any longer than he had to be, and then BE hired CKE who probably wasn't going to stay long-term either) is what we have to get over. We need consistency from the top...coaches will always leave, how do you cope with that? We all hate vcu but they've hired nothing but great coaches for going on 20 years now, and they've done it because they run their athletic department well and know what they are looking for.

Lots of noise on here back when we were sucking about our identity. All our frustration seems tainted through that. We don't have one...what are we going to do about it?

 

[gmubrian]

Not at all saying you’re wrong, just don’t understand what Providence gains from pressuring Kim by leaking misinformation to the press. If they really want him, potentially pissing him off and leading him to stay at Mason would seem to be the worst possible scenario.

Embarrassing to say the least if he was their No. 1 choice and he turns them down to stay at a middling A-10 school.

At face value, it wouldn't make sense, but, if you can create discontent in the fanbase (like they have succeeded in doing based on the posts I have been reading on here today), you start to create a situation where the guy doesn't want to/or almost can't go back very easily.

 

[He15man]

There are a lot of sides to this but I keep thinking that the instability of losing CKE right now is the biggest downside...he made some considerable improvements to the program but nothing that I don't think another coach would have been able to accomplish. At the same time, starting over and losing key recruits would be a rough pill to swallow.

That being said, CKE doesn't have a ton of stability from the school right now either. No AD, and still months away from one. If I was working somewhere and my boss quit, and they were still looking for my new boss, and another company tried to poach me with more money, you bet I'm going to consider it. I can't fault the guy, and neither should any of you. We could easily hire a new AD who doesn't like CKE and makes life difficult for him, and by that point the offers might be dried up and he'd be in a bad spot.

Overall the frustration of Mason just being a stepping stone for people (Cabrera used us, Cabrera hired Brad Edwards who clearly wasn't going to be here any longer than he had to be, and then BE hired CKE who probably wasn't going to stay long-term either) is what we have to get over. We need consistency from the top...coaches will always leave, how do you cope with that? We all hate vcu but they've hired nothing but great coaches for going on 20 years now, and they've done it because they run their athletic department well and know what they are looking for.

Lots of noise on here back when we were sucking about our identity. All our frustration seems tainted through that. We don't have one...what are we going to do about it?

Agree. P5 programs have their coaches poached just as well. Unless your name is Duke, Kansas, North Carolina, Kentucky, Indiana, UCLA, etc... then the sad reality is you're a stepping stone to those types of "blue blood" jobs. In our case, I want a guy who wants to be here longer than 2 years too. No question. But I also don't fault a guy for wanting to hear out a suiter that wants to triple his annual salary. I mean, hell, I'd do the same damn thing. I think you'd be crazy not to, especially as a father in a business that is as tumultuous as college coaching. This is life-changing, generational money. Doesn't mean he'll take it though if our counter offer is strong enough...

 

[He15man]

At face value, it wouldn't make sense, but, if you can create discontent in the fanbase (like they have succeeded in doing based on the posts I have been reading on here today), you start to create a situation where the guy doesn't want to/or almost can't go back very easily.

bingo

 

[gmujim92]

I don't disagree. I don't think it's a smart strategy either. But... if I was desperate to get a hire that wouldn't result in an uproar with my fans... the thinking might be to release information that makes Mason fans in this instance go apeshit and start hurling insults his way to make him want to just say screw it and go with the new paycheck and conference vs. hearing his current bosses out. If we start destroying him and calling him a traitor in the same way Providence fans are crucifying Cooley, then maybe 1 of 2 things happens... he sees that we Mason fans are no better, and who wants to coach for an ungrateful fanbase? Or two... we at least look as petty and spiteful as their fans do. So why not get paid more and not be the focus of that same spite?

I'm not saying that's the thinking. I'm just theorizing. Because I also thought it an idiotic strategy when i heard it.

Good point by you and @gmubrian and one I hadn’t considered. But then I find myself wondering why Kim would be mad about the reports that he’s PC’s leading candidate … if you really are open to the possibility of staying at Mason, having that info out publicly is almost certainly the best way to get Dr W to make the strongest possible counter-offer.

I don’t know Kim personally so he may be different, but from experience once a school with more $ zeroes in on a target, it generally just becomes about figuring out where the final number needs to settle for both sides to be happy.

 

[Verdad]

My issues stem 100% from him trying to get the job, with it being largely irrelevant to me if he actually gets it. That is what communicates to me about his intention being from day 1 to get to the next job as quickly as possible.

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe it was the condition of the AD that changed his mind and made him want to leave. But I've had the impression of a used car salesman from the beginning, and it only grew over time. So this whole thing reinforces that impression.

I also don't fault him as a human being and an employee taking a pay raise. But, I'm a fan of my school and f anyone who uses it that way. If he is indeed hired at Providence, which I would bet he will be, he will be added to the list of enemies based on fandom - not real life.

It is the players who would be in a position to have the real life gripes, especially recent commits.

 

[GMU79]

I won't rip the guy for leaving, however, I will rip him for not thinking anything would leak. He's the king of social media. Seriously? You don't think one of those booster wouldn't have loose lips? Also, I'm sure his agent has been blabbering to Rothstein, Goodman, et al. You want a raise, you want the shine? Well, guess what? The leaks and scuttlebutt come with it.

Agreed. Except I will rip him for leaving.

 

[He15man]

Good point by you and @gmubrian and one I hadn’t considered. But then I find myself wondering why Kim would be mad about the reports that he’s PC’s leading candidate … if you really are open to the possibility of staying at Mason, having that info out publicly is almost certainly the best way to get Dr W to make the strongest possible counter-offer.

I don’t know Kim personally so he may be different, but from experience once a school with more $ zeroes in on a target, it generally just becomes about figuring out where the final number needs to settle for both sides to be happy.

100% agree. I don't know this for certain, but my gut tells me that this comes down to a combination of things. Of course, the money needs to be a number that's not a low-ball offer. But at the same time, we might not need to be the biggest either. CKE turned down more money at P5 conferences to come to Mason, and in large part because he's smart and take advice from people who've been in this business awhile (e.g., Barnes). So while he's going to naturally want to see more money, I don't think he's just in this for the biggest bag either because I've heard KE is a big relationship guy. Dr. W is a big fan and supporter of his, as are other senior members of the administration. So I bet his comfort level with our leadership factors into this as well. Just my guess based on what I've heard about him as a person.

Still stands to see what happens after he hears and considers our counter... but I definitely don't think our goose is cooked here.

 

[Pikapppatri8]

100% agree. I don't know this for certain, but my gut tells me that this comes down to a combination of things. Of course, the money needs to be a number that's not a low-ball offer. But at the same time, we might not need to be the biggest either. CKE turned down more money at P5 conferences to come to Mason, and in large part because he's smart and take advice from people who've been in this business awhile (e.g., Barnes). So while he's going to naturally want to see more money, I don't think he's just in this for the biggest bag either because I've heard KE is a big relationship guy. Dr. W is a big fan and supporter of his, as are other senior members of the administration. So I bet his comfort level with our leadership factors into this as well. Just my guess based on what I've heard about him as a person.

Still stands to see what happens after he hears and considers our counter... but I definitely don't think our goose is cooked here.

If its like you describe - then we need to do a better job of not getting sand in our vagina over loose rumors on the internet.

 

[He15man]

If its like you describe - then we need to do a better job of not getting sand in our vagina over loose rumors on the internet.

Haha... IMO, yes as far as rumors go. Which is what they still are at this moment in time. I think we truly are giving the Providence boosters/fanbase/administration what they want via these misinformation leaks by firebombing him.

But, once we see actual confirmations from the schools in question... then i get it. That's when you can at least justify the gloves coming off.

 

[bravesfan]

Haha... IMO, yes as far as rumors go. Which is what they still are at this moment in time. I think we truly are giving the Providence boosters/fanbase/administration what they want via these misinformation leaks by firebombing him.

But, once we see actual confirmations from the schools in question... then i get it. That's when you can at least justify the gloves coming off.

So what's the promises being made to him? Higher salary? More for assistants? Commitment to increased resources? Private room at the Camelot?

 

[MasonMojo]

For anyone that thinks poor little old Kimmy is just a victim of misinformation and rumors from twitter trolls, he could have put all this to bed EASILY already and he hasn't. Don't be fooled again by this shyster.

 

[Patriotsince81]

For anyone that thinks poor little old Kimmy is just a victim of misinformation and rumors from twitter trolls, he could have put all this to bed EASILY already and he hasn't. Don't be fooled again by this shyster.

Agree 100%. All he had to do was post something to the effect that he was aware of rumors and flattered by the attention but that he had no intention of leaving GMU. If he was going to stay he'd have done that two days ago.

 

[GMUgemini]

For anyone that thinks poor little old Kimmy is just a victim of misinformation and rumors from twitter trolls, he could have put all this to bed EASILY already and he hasn't. Don't be fooled again by this shyster.

I don’t think the poster is saying he’s not entertaining the job, only that the deal isn’t done and that Washington is trying to bring a strong offer to entice him to stay. In other words, nothing is done yet and everyone trashing English is doing it prematurely.

I don’t think we’d even be in this spot if Providence didn’t unexpectedly lost Cooley. Not sure there is another job opening up this year that English would even want (e.g. Iona) or be qualified for (e.g. Syracuse). Just some unfortunate timing here.

To be honest, I’m a little surprised that English is being this strongly pursued by Providence. I think English is going to be a successful coach someday, but also thought he was still on a learning curve of how to manage a program and now he’s got to do that learning with the big boys. But if this deal goes through, if Providence is patient, I think the gamble is going to pay off. He’s going to do good things there before he goes to a bigger school.

 

[He15man]

For anyone that thinks poor little old Kimmy is just a victim of misinformation and rumors from twitter trolls, he could have put all this to bed EASILY already and he hasn't. Don't be fooled again by this shyster.

You all are free to believe what you want. All I've been trying to offer up here based on what I know is that the reports of this being a done deal aren't accurate, and Mason is still in it. At this moment in time, KE is weighing two offers. For those of us that want the guy to stick around... I hope that brings some peace of mind for now. For those that don't, well... I don't know what to tell you...

 

[gmujim92]

I don’t think the poster is saying he’s not entertaining the job, only that the deal isn’t done and that Washington is trying to bring a strong offer to entice him to stay. In other words, nothing is done yet and everyone trashing English is doing it prematurely.

I don’t think we’d even be in this spot if Providence didn’t unexpectedly lost Cooley. Not sure there is another job opening up this year that English would even want (e.g. Iona) or be qualified for (e.g. Syracuse). Just some unfortunate timing here.

To be honest, I’m a little surprised that English is being this strongly pursued by Providence. I think English is going to be a successful coach someday, but also thought he was still on a learning curve of how to manage a program and now he’s got to do that learning with the big boys. But if this deal goes through, if Providence is patient, I think the gamble is going to pay off. He’s going to do good things there before he goes to a bigger school.

Right, and nobody should blame him for listening. Anyone who says they wouldn’t entertain an offer to double or triple your salary is either a fool, a liar or both

 

[EXpatriot13]

But if this deal goes through, if Providence is patient, I think the gamble is going to pay off. He’s going to do good things there before he goes to a bigger school.

I don't see any scenario where Providence shows patience. They've made the tournament 7 out of the last 9 years, and just lost their Coach L. Kim needs to win immediately or the pressure cooker will be screaming.

 

[rf1]

The Providence College tweet announcing the hire has a photo of CKE holding a ball with the Mason logo.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1638554874588610560

View: https://twitter.com/providencecbb/status/1638554874588610560

 

[GSII]

its a fake account

 

[Five Two]

The Providence College tweet announcing the hire has a photo of CKE holding a ball with the Mason logo.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1638554874588610560

View: https://twitter.com/providencecbb/status/1638554874588610560

FYI- that is not the official twitter account for Providence hoops. Still, you'd think the person behind this account could use a different basketball