MIAMI UPDATE

[Quentin Daniels]

• 
  

  Maybe it will. But doesn't seem odd all of the others (Johnson, Kellogg, Courtney, Cherry, etc) had to leave from L's staff, go be an assistant elsewhere and THEN get their shot at a D1 job? Weird....

  • Johnson became head coach at Va Tech after being an Asst. at Tech. - not weird
  • Kellog was a first time coach at Mason, got a head coaching job after 9 more years of experience including 8 years under Calipari - not weird
  • Courtney got his after an additional 5 years coaching in Big East & ACC for Providence, Virginia & Va Tech - not weird
  • Cherry had to go to an SEC school in the Carolinas and learn that recruiting area before getting a job a Carolina school - not weird
  You can also add Stan Heath, whose dream job was to coach at Michigan State and Larranaga helped him get that job, before getting a job at Kent State.
  

 

[gmujim92]

I'd love to see Caputo come back as HC.

The guy is one helluva recruiter, has tons of energy and he has learned at the feet of the best coach in our program's history.

He's gonna be a star in this business. No reason at all not to give him his first chance to run a program.

 

[KAOriginal]

Edwards apparently talks to AD Littlepage at UVa a whole lot.....so look down the UVa assistants see if there is anyone you like.....

 

[gmujim92]

Edwards apparently talks to AD Littlepage at UVa a whole lot.....so look down the UVa assistants see if there is anyone you like.....

Considering how Littlepage has screwed up their football coaching situation, he's the last one I want Edwards talking to.

If we absolutely had to hire somebody from UVa, I'd take Jason Williford. Young guy, good recruiter and God knows he'd have tough defensive teams after working with Bennett.

We could certainly do worse.

 

[A.-Siegfried]

• • Johnson became head coach at Va Tech after being an Asst. at Tech. - not weird
  • Kellog was a first time coach at Mason, got a head coaching job after 9 more years of experience including 8 years under Calipari - not weird
  • Courtney got his after an additional 5 years coaching in Big East & ACC for Providence, Virginia & Va Tech - not weird
  • Cherry had to go to an SEC school in the Carolinas and learn that recruiting area before getting a job a Carolina school - not weird
  You can also add Stan Heath, whose dream job was to coach at Michigan State and Larranaga helped him get that job, before getting a job at Kent State.

No, the weird part is, for all the success, for all the praise we heap on Coach L, NONE of his assistants go from him staff to landing a D1 job. None of them.

Again...seems odd, no?

 

[Vurbel]

Let's assume L's base salary at Miami is $1.2M and Hewitt's base salary is $625,000. That's a difference of $575,000, which sounds like a lot, but...

The average attendance last year was 4,916. The average in L's last year was 5,896. That's a difference of 980. Assuming tickets are $15 (some more, some less) that's $14,700/game. At 14 home games/year (not counting exhibition) that's a $205,800/season difference.
If PH is not kept for next season that's $625,000 we would have to pay, which averages to $156,250 over four seasons. With this in mind, his average base salary would come to $781,250. Add the $205,800 in attendance we lost to the base salary of $781,250 you have $987,050.
So really the difference is $212,950 in keeping L vs. not keeping L.

All of this is without consideration of increase pay for assistants, Patriot Club donation differences, donations to the university differences, hometown discount, sponsorship, etc.

I wasn't a math major so some of the figures may be off a little, but you get the general idea.

 

[Quentin Daniels]

No, the weird part is, for all the success, for all the praise we heap on Coach L, NONE of his assistants go from him staff to landing a D1 job. None of them.

Again...seems odd, no?

CAA & MACC Assistants typically don't. If the trend continues going forward, than you have a point.

Also, Mike Gillian.

 

[GSII]

No, the weird part is, for all the success, for all the praise we heap on Coach L, NONE of his assistants go from him staff to landing a D1 job. None of them.

Again...seems odd, no?

Steve Merfeld took Hampton to the NCAA and won in his first trip upsetting Iowa St in 2001. OCM got his first in 2006. Regardless if they go directly to a HC position or not, it seems like they know what they are doing once they get there. For the most part anyway. Gillian didnt do squat at Longwood, but John Wooden wouldnt either.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

Literally everyone is to blame for the Larranaga situation, including the diva Larranaga who wanted his fourth raise in five years. After he said twice in those five years his present raise would, QUOTE, "allow him to retire in Fairfax."

Literally everyone except me is responsible. I was planning my wedding at the time, attending multiple bachelor parties, and also hunting down Bin Laden, and cannot be held responsible in any way.

 

[P8triotfan4rightnow]

I'm not sure the raise he was looking for was just for himself. I think he felt the assistant coaches were underpaid relative to others in the conference.

Literally everyone is to blame for the Larranaga situation, including the diva Larranaga who wanted his fourth raise in five years. After he said twice in those five years his present raise would, QUOTE, "allow him to retire in Fairfax."

Literally everyone except me is responsible. I was planning my wedding at the time, attending multiple bachelor parties, and also hunting down Bin Laden, and cannot be held responsible in any way.

 

[CHRISTOPHER JAMES JOLLAY]

I'm not sure the raise he was looking for was just for himself. I think he felt the assistant coaches were underpaid relative to others in the conference.

One time I coached HS I gave 50% of my salary to assistants. If I can make that work, I'm sure Jesus (pronounced Hey-Zeus) could have dug up some change for the boys off his three raises in five years.

The only thing that changed was Shaka got paid. Period.

 

[GSII]

vcu gambled. Mason just didnt invest. Whatever the raises were, they werent enough as now most of wouldnt care if L was here making 2 million after the shit show we had to watch.

 

[gmujim92]

The only thing that changed was Shaka got paid. Period.

That's true.

vcu set the market for Final Four coaches from the CAA by bumping Shaka from $300,000 to $1.3MM.

And instead of recognizing (as Mike Rao did at vcu) the significance of men's basketball to Mason's previously nonexistent national identity, Merten blinked.

Not sure how anybody can blame Larranaga for trying to get market value for his services, especially after watching a coach in his conference get a million-dollar raise after his second year on the job.

The problem is, he should've gotten it at Mason.

 

[wijg]

Much like 99, the whole fixation on L seems odd to me, but I guess in a way it is understandable given where we are now...

I hate to get involved in the reliving that time, but since it is relevant to our current situation, I thought it would be worth jumping in. I have no issue with Coach L wanting and getting market pay for a final four coach. The only issue is that Mason couldn't (wouldn't) afford to give it to him (given current budget and priorities). So, expecting it from Mason was a bad expectation. So he had a choice, take what Mason could give him or get more from somewhere else that valued basketball more and had deeper pockets. If you look at his raises and what we got financially from the final four, Mason basically paid him every extra penny it got from the final four. As Jollay pointed out, he could have taken money from his numerous raises out of his own pocket and paid it to the assistants if that was the main sticking point. It would have made him even more of a god with Mason fans when the word got out. He didn't and that is fine, not complaint from me. He is doing great at Miami and hopefully he is as happy there as he was here. Best of luck to him.

How is this relevant to Mason at the present time and why I am concerned? It is not clear yet that we are willing to do what it takes to succeed at the A10 level. It was clear after last year, when a very experienced team showed zero improvement from the previous year, that Hewitt should go. The word is that Mason couldn't afford to pay him out and a pay a new up and coming coach. When you factor in that we would have made much of the money back in years 3, 4 and 5 of a new coaches contract, ticket sales and donations that have gone away due to keeping Hewitt, the amount of money that would have been needed was mostly the interest it would have taken for the school to loan itself the money for a couple years.

So my concern is this, is Mason really ready to commit to do what is necessary to succeed in the A10? With the change to Cabrera and Edwards, maybe we are, but there is yet to be enough evidence to make me confident that we are. Cabrera chose to go to the A10 and chose Edwards who looks good on paper. Both potentially good things. But, I have yet to see anything from Edwards that tells me either way he is going to solve it. Hopefully we will see something significant (big money brought in, big changes for the positive, etc.) that will show us we are ready to do what it takes.

I hope so, because if not, we should go back to a lesser league and be kings there. And I don't really want to do that, but it would be better than the status quo.

 

[mason lawyer]

Much like 99, the whole fixation on L seems odd to me, but I guess in a way it is understandable given where we are now...

I hate to get involved in the reliving that time, but since it is relevant to our current situation, I thought it would be worth jumping in. I have no issue with Coach L wanting and getting market pay for a final four coach. The only issue is that Mason couldn't (wouldn't) afford to give it to him (given current budget and priorities). So, expecting it from Mason was a bad expectation. So he had a choice, take what Mason could give him or get more from somewhere else that valued basketball more and had deeper pockets. If you look at his raises and what we got financially from the final four, Mason basically paid him every extra penny it got from the final four. As Jollay pointed out, he could have taken money from his numerous raises out of his own pocket and paid it to the assistants if that was the main sticking point. It would have made him even more of a god with Mason fans when the word got out. He didn't and that is fine, not complaint from me. He is doing great at Miami and hopefully he is as happy there as he was here. Best of luck to him.

How is this relevant to Mason at the present time and why I am concerned? It is not clear yet that we are willing to do what it takes to succeed at the A10 level. It was clear after last year, when a very experienced team showed zero improvement from the previous year, that Hewitt should go. The word is that Mason couldn't afford to pay him out and a pay a new up and coming coach. When you factor in that we would have made much of the money back in years 3, 4 and 5 of a new coaches contract, ticket sales and donations that have gone away due to keeping Hewitt, the amount of money that would have been needed was mostly the interest it would have taken for the school to loan itself the money for a couple years.

So my concern is this, is Mason really ready to commit to do what is necessary to succeed in the A10? With the change to Cabrera and Edwards, maybe we are, but there is yet to be enough evidence to make me confident that we are. Cabrera chose to go to the A10 and chose Edwards who looks good on paper. Both potentially good things. But, I have yet to see anything from Edwards that tells me either way he is going to solve it. Hopefully we will see something significant (big money brought in, big changes for the positive, etc.) that will show us we are ready to do what it takes.

I hope so, because if not, we should go back to a lesser league and be kings there. And I don't really want to do that, but it would be better than the status quo.

I think we could probably be kings of a league in division 2. Definitely not division one at the moment.

 

[Walter]

I am assuming that when Edwards was hired, a top criteria was ability to raise funds. How is he doing? I have no idea.

I would rather be the new Fordham in the A-10 then go back to the CAA. It isn't the CAA of old. There isn't anything of value for us there anymore.

And I believe we are paying our coach a very competitive A10 salary. We should be able to attract a raising star. We are no longer the program that Roy Williams passed on.

 

[wijg]

I am assuming that when Edwards was hired, a top criteria was ability to raise funds. How is he doing? I have no idea.

I would rather be the new Fordham in the A-10 then go back to the CAA. It isn't the CAA of old. There isn't anything of value for us there anymore.

And I believe we are paying our coach a very competitive A10 salary. We should be able to attract a raising star. We are no longer the program that Roy Williams passed on.

Walter, I was not suggesting, necessarily the CAA, but the CAA may not have imploded as much if we had stayed.

Also, there is more than what you pay the head coach, though that is some of it. You have to be able to afford to pay him to go away if he doesn't pan out. We obviously aren't there yet. I hope we do, but if not, I would not want to be the new Fordham in perpetuity.

 

[KAOriginal]

How is this relevant to Mason at the present time and why I am concerned? It is not clear yet that we are willing to do what it takes to succeed at the A10 level.

I may be naive...but this point is the crux of the question about Mason.

I never heard the entire fiasco was just about L's salary. There's mention of the assistants, the basketball facility, etc etc.

For the sake of argument, let's L knew the (cant recall the time lines) clock was ticking on TOC and Merten. He sees vcu, etc spending/investing in their program.

Was this really less of a question about his own paycheck....and more about Mason's commitment to basketball? Again, we have argued that certain people at Mason were treating our FF as lottery win and nothing more.

Mason wasnt going to blow out Hewitt so quick...I get that. BUT, does the new regime want a successful program that actually competes and has success...or we're okay as long as gets graduate and we are cellar dwellers.....

 

[gmujim92]

Look at how our campus has been transformed over the past 10-15 years and tell me with a straight face that it looks like we're hurting for money.

It's a matter of priorities, plain and simple.

Athletics, and specifically men's basketball, was priority No. 567 for Merten.

Is it a much higher priority for Cabrera and Edwards for Mason to succeed in our lone money-making sport? I certainly hope so, but jury's still out I guess.

 

[GSII]

We have the money to pay him. If you look at the incentives built into his contract, the school has to budget closer to a million just for Hewitt in case he takes us deep into Ncaa tourney (haaaaa). Being that he hasnt met hardly any of his incentives in last 3 years theres close to a million bucks waiting to help with a buyout and a years worth of a new coaches salary.