Time to Get it Right

GMUBR88

Recruit
As a long, long time fan of GMU basketball I have experienced some of the highest highs and some pretty low lows. I will always be a fan, but as I write this today I am on the edge of despair. There is no reason for any GMU hoops fan to be optimistic, and I summarize:

* Joe Harrington - A pretty exciting hire at the time, and got some things done. Spent 16 years as a DIV I head coach and never went to an NCAA tourney.

* Rick Barnes - Snatched up by Providence in 1988 after only 2 seasons building a good GMU team.

* Ernie Nestor - Took what Barnes built and ran it into the ground. Fired after 5 seasons and never coached a winning team again. Left the cupboard bare.

* Paul Westhead - Novel experiment. Managed to lose more than his predecessor. He needed more player horsepower than a losing CAA Team could attract.

* Jim Larranaga - Nuff said. Took the mess Westhead left and turned it around in only 2 years. Gave us 14 years and left due to an institutional lack of commitment to the program. More on that later.

* Paul Hewitt - Softball question: What did he lack at GA Tech (where he was paid to leave) that GMU provided? Nothing, and nothing Larranaga built survived the Hewitt era. Perhaps the most critical hire in program history and we take an ACC retread who posted exactly 1 winning season in the ACC out of 11. One. Why did we think a guy who spent 11 seasons losing in the ACC with a steady diet of 4 star recruits was the right guy to make it happen with 2 and 3 star players?

* Dave Paulsen - A middle of the road hire. Didn't seem to recruit very well and couldn't keep a lot of the players he did recruit. Liked gritty players who would fight hard, but didn't seem to have the ability to deal with the fragile egos that often accompany talent. His 13-9 season in 20/21 edged him above 500 for his GMU career, which qualifies him as above average for our program. Sad, right?

* Kim English (Barnes II) - Snatched up by Providence in 2023 after only 2 seasons building a good GMU team. Unlike Barnes, though, English was a terrible hire. Why? Barnes! This outcome was perfectly predictable, as the fruit does not fall far from the tree. Barnes brokered the deal to get English to Providence! Honestly, based upon how poorly we performed this year in the closing moments of some close games, I am not even sure Providence got a good deal. The winning streak at the end of the season was impressive, but was it pretty?

The difference between prior failure to make a commitment to GMU hoops and 2023's equal lack of commitment is the consequence to recruiting and the roster. We have already lost our best recruit of the past 5+ seasons, one solid 2023 commit and Oduro's redshirt season. More transfers out and decommits will follow, and prospects for replacements for these players are bleak.

Our program is an empty shell. The loyal fan base built up in the early days of the Patriot Center and rebuilt under coach L is gone, and now our team plays to mostly vacant seats. Zero NCAA tournament appearacnes, zero NIT bids since Larranaga left. A whopping two, TWO CBI bids in the past 10 seasons.

How will we attract a quality coach to this mess? We don't even have an AD!!!

The time is now for the administration to step up. Hire a quality AD with a vision and marching orders to make it happen! Commit the resources to the program - not just the head coach, but also for assistants! In return demand (and contract) for a commitment back from the selected coach. We are used as a stepping stone because we don't believe in our own program. Make it clear, you want this job, you are here for 5 years, during which you will get what you need to be successful. Identify only a very few, very attractive schools for an out-clause. Our coaches should not be leaving for Providence. Texas? Sure. Alabama, Maryland? Maybe. Providence, no way.

Other A-10 schools, especially vcu and Richmond, have shown the way. Yes, they have also lost coaches to major programs, but the quality of the system and the administration have proven those coaches (notably Grant and Smart) were not the only ingredient for success. Go watch a game at Robbins center, even in a down year, and tell me you don't spot the difference immediately. We can't gradually change what is a systemic failure.

The stench of losing is all over Mason Nation and the fans are not dummies. Nothing has changed, and until it does we are where we are. For context, this year we celebrated a 5th place finish in the A-10 and were blown out in the 2nd round of the tournament. The only thing the 2022/23 team accomplished was looking good in comparison to the past 10 years, and that is a very low bar.
 
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gmujim92

Hall of Famer
GIVING DAY 2023
As a long, long time fan of GMU basketball I have experienced some of the highest highs and some pretty low lows. I will always be a fan, but as I write this today I am on the edge of despair. There is no reason for any GMU hoops fan to be optimistic, and I summarize:

* Joe Harrington - A pretty exciting hire at the time, and got some things done. Spent 16 years as a DIV I head coach and never went to an NCAA tourney.

* Rick Barnes - Snatched up by Providence in 1988 after only 2 seasons building a good GMU team.

* Ernie Nestor - Took what Barnes built and ran it into the ground. Fired after 5 seasons and never coached a winning team again. Left the cupboard bare.

* Paul Westhead - Novel experiment. Managed to lose more than his predecessor. He needed more player horsepower than a losing CAA Team could attract.

* Jim Larranaga - Nuff said. Took the mess Westhead left and turned it around in only 2 years. Gave us 14 years and left due to an institutional lack of commitment to the program. More on that later.

* Paul Hewitt - Softball question: What did he lack at GA Tech (where he was paid to leave) that GMU provided? Nothing, and nothing Larranaga built survived the Hewitt era. Perhaps the most critical hire in program history and we take an ACC retread who posted exactly 1 winning season in the ACC out of 11. One. Why did we think a guy who spent 11 seasons losing in the ACC with a steady diet of 4 star recruits was the right guy to make it happen with 2 and 3 star players?

* Dave Paulsen - A middle of the road hire. Didn't seem to recruit very well and couldn't keep a lot of the players he did recruit. Liked gritty players who would fight hard, but didn't seem to have the ability to deal with the fragile egos that often accompany talent. His 13-9 season in 20/21 edged him above 500 for his GMU career, which qualifies him as above average for our program. Sad, right?

* Kim English (Barnes II) - Snatched up by Providence in 2023 after only 2 seasons building a good GMU team. Unlike Barnes, though, English was a terrible hire. Why? Barnes! This outcome was perfectly predictable, as the fruit does not fall far from the tree. Barnes brokered the deal to get English to Providence! Honestly, based upon how poorly we performed this year in the closing moments of some close games, I am not even sure Providence got a good deal. The winning streak at the end of the season was impressive, but was it pretty?

The difference between prior failure to make a commitment to GMU hoops and 2023's equal lack of commitment is the consequence to recruiting and the roster. We have already lost our best recruit of the past 5+ seasons, one solid 2023 commit and Oduro's redshirt season. More transfers out and decommits will follow, and prospects for replacements for these players are bleak.

Our program is an empty shell. The loyal fan base built up in the early days of the Patriot Center and rebuilt under coach L is gone, and now our team plays to mostly vacant seats. Zero NCAA tournament appearacnes, zero NIT bids since Larranaga left. A whopping two, TWO CBI bids in the past 10 seasons.

How will we attract a quality coach to this mess? We don't even have an AD!!!

The time is now for the administration to step up. Hire a quality AD with a vision and marching orders to make it happen! Commit the resources to the program - not just the head coach, but also for assistants! In return demand (and contract) for a commitment back from the selected coach. We are used as a stepping stone because we don't believe in our own program. Make it clear, you want this job, you are here for 5 years, during which you will get what you need to be successful. Identify only a very few, very attractive schools for an out-clause. Our coaches should not be leaving for Providence. Texas? Sure. Alabama, Maryland? Maybe. Providence, no way.

Other A-10 schools, especially vcu and Richmond, have shown the way. Yes, they have also lost coaches to major programs, but the quality of the system and the administration have proven those coaches (notably Grant and Smart) were not the only ingredient for success. Go watch a game at Robbins center, even in a down year, and tell me you don't spot the difference immediately. We can't gradually change what is a systemic failure.

The stench of losing is all over Mason Nation and the fans are not dummies. Nothing has changed, and until it does we are where we are. For context, this year we celebrated a 5th place finish in the A-10 and were blown out in the 2nd round of the tournament. The only thing the 2022/23 team accomplished was looking good in comparison to the past 10 years, and that is a very low bar.
You had me until Richmond. The last coach they lost to a major program was almost 20 years ago.
 

gmubrian

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GIVING DAY 2023
. . . I'm very much over the recently created accounts coming on here just to create threads to tell us not to be optimistic.
I know. Where the hell have they been? Let’s use some of that (creepy ) AI technology to only allow positive posts for, say, like six months. Make them earn the right to lecture us on how bad our program is.

I hope that all of the passion we are seeing this week translates to support, in whatever way they can, this coming season.
 

Patriot Lawdog

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I know. Where the hell have they been? Let’s use some of that (creepy ) AI technology to only allow positive posts for, say, like six months. Make them earn the right to lecture us on how bad our program is.

I hope that all of the passion we are seeing this week translates to support, in whatever way they can, this coming season.
I mean, if we had this many hardcore fans in real life, we probably wouldn't be in this situation right now.
 
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Old Man

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I hope that all of the passion we are seeing this week translates to support, in whatever way they can, this coming season.
And for you newbies, when Brian says support, he means butts in seats and donations to the Patriot Club and ... gulp ... Patriot Nation Collective.

Don't just come on here and bi### and moan about things until you've got some Skinn in the game! (See what I did there?)

Many of us have been here since the Bastards used to heckle the opposing coach in the Lynn Gym before the PatDome existed. We've drank many a beer at the under-concourse bar at the Big Brown Turd in Richmond. And of course, many of us were with the team all the way from Fairfax to Dayton to Wash DC to Indianapolis.

My point is, you want to complain, cool. Come do it with the rest of us in the Green or the Gold rooms on game nights. The beer is cold and the friendships long.
 

GMU_Polevaulter

Preferred Walk-On
Reference to Richmond maybe the environment?? Richmond sold out their last few A-10 games this year (of course NCAA tournaments last year helps). I was surprised how loud it got during the final game of the season against GMU in the Robins center. They also do non-stop promoting on all types of media to sell game tickets. I noticed they did a lot of $20 for 2 game deals, Hot dog and game, 2 beers and a game etc. etc. Surely can't be the coach - their fan base took out a Billboard to get rid of their coach a few years ago.
 
OP
G

GMUBR88

Recruit
And for you newbies, when Brian says support, he means butts in seats and donations to the Patriot Club and ... gulp ... Patriot Nation Collective.

Don't just come on here and bi### and moan about things until you've got some Skinn in the game! (See what I did there?)

Many of us have been here since the Bastards used to heckle the opposing coach in the Lynn Gym before the PatDome existed. We've drank many a beer at the under-concourse bar at the Big Brown Turd in Richmond. And of course, many of us were with the team all the way from Fairfax to Dayton to Wash DC to Indianapolis.

My point is, you want to complain, cool. Come do it with the rest of us in the Green or the Gold rooms on game nights. The beer is cold and the friendships long.
I don’t live locally but I do support the alumni association and I travel to games when I can. If there is someone on the thread who has information to give cause for optimism I’m all ears - I want to be excited about the future. From my perspective we are looking at a season of rounding out the roster with walk-ons and maybe 5 to 7 wins. More important than next year is the long-term, and lacking a seismic shift we are looking at more of the same. I don’t want to complain, but after 35 years of watching us mostly get it wrong spoke up. Perhaps more should.
 
OP
G

GMUBR88

Recruit
And for you newbies, when Brian says support, he means butts in seats and donations to the Patriot Club and ... gulp ... Patriot Nation Collective.

Don't just come on here and bi### and moan about things until you've got some Skinn in the game! (See what I did there?)

Many of us have been here since the Bastards used to heckle the opposing coach in the Lynn Gym before the PatDome existed. We've drank many a beer at the under-concourse bar at the Big Brown Turd in Richmond. And of course, many of us were with the team all the way from Fairfax to Dayton to Wash DC to Indianapolis.

My point is, you want to complain, cool. Come do it with the rest of us in the Green or the Gold rooms on game nights. The beer is cold and the friendships long.
I was in Dayton and Indy.
 

JPgmuswim

Starter
I don’t live locally but I do support the alumni association and I travel to games when I can. If there is someone on the thread who has information to give cause for optimism I’m all ears - I want to be excited about the future. From my perspective we are looking at a season of rounding out the roster with walk-ons and maybe 5 to 7 wins. More important than next year is the long-term, and lacking a seismic shift we are looking at more of the same. I don’t want to complain, but after 35 years of watching us mostly get it wrong spoke up. Perhaps more should.
Rounding out the roster with Walk-On’s really won’t be a thing with the fact that every year more and more kids enter the portal and they no longer have to sit.
They’ll always be kids that walk-on for extra bodies in practice but the new coach won’t need to fill his roster with them.
 

GSII

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GIVING DAY 2023
Speaking of getting it right ......what role have they played and who is the Board of Trustees of GMU?

Our BOT vs Uva vs Jmu vs VT....what's the make up? Bunch of lawyers? Entrepreneurs/ceo's?

Just curious because it seems The athletic department is floundering. Maybe there is so much going on in other parts of the University they can't keep up.
 

psyclone

Hall of Famer
Speaking of getting it right ......what role have they played and who is the Board of Trustees of GMU?

Our BOT vs Uva vs Jmu vs VT....what's the make up? Bunch of lawyers? Entrepreneurs/ceo's?

Just curious because it seems The athletic department is floundering. Maybe there is so much going on in other parts of the University they can't keep up.
I can't speak to the dynamics to the Board of Visitors or compare them to those of other Va universities, but the members and their brief bios can be found here:
 

Walter

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So I just looked at the boards of JMU and Mason. Biggest difference I see is that JMU's BOV has a lot more JMU graduates (10 of 16 and most probably undergraduate alumni) serving on the board. Only two GMU BOV members graduated from Mason as undergraduates and two are graduate school alumni.

10 of 16 vs 4 of 16. Does that mean that JMU's BOV is of higher quality than Mason's? No, but it does indicate that JMU's board members might care more deeply about JMU.
 

Patriot Lawdog

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So I just looked at the boards of JMU and Mason. Biggest difference I see is that JMU's BOV has a lot more JMU graduates (10 of 16 and most probably undergraduate alumni) serving on the board. Only two GMU BOV members graduated from Mason as undergraduates and two are graduate school alumni.

10 of 16 vs 4 of 16. Does that mean that JMU's BOV is of higher quality than Mason's? No, but it does indicate that JMU's board members might care more deeply about JMU.
This is what I always suspected has been the deep seeded problem. People making the calls that don't really care that much about the university.
 
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